MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature!

by Truth_or_Dare Wed Oct 21, 2009 11:57 am

Jackson's Will -- Randy Says Not MJ's Signature

Posted Oct 21st 2009 1:35PM by TMZ Staff
Randy Jackson claims Michael Jackson could not have signed his 2002 will, because he was 2,475 air miles away from the place the document was supposedly inked.

MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! 1021_mj_will_sig_02_ex

MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! 1021_mj_will_sig_02_ex

According to the will,
it was signed on July 7, 2002 at 5:00 PM in Los Angeles. Randy Jackson
tells TMZ he has proof MJ was in New York from July 5 through July 9,
on a campaign against Sony honcho Tommy Mottola, claiming Mottolahad a thing against Black artists.

The lawyer for the estate, Howard Weitzman,
tells TMZ the witnesses to the will were face-to-face with Jackson when
he signed the document. Weitzman would not say if the will was signed
in L.A., even though the document refers to Los Angeles.

The intimation -- the will may actually have been signed outside of L.A. even though it says Los Angeles.

The plot thickens.
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/10/21/jacksons-will-randy-says-not-mjs-signature/#ixzz0UaubqI1x

by ishealive Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:11 pm

Hmmm the plot does thicken... So Randy is saying the will is fake - what's his motive for doing this!

by jpresley Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:11 pm

Entry updated to reflect this little tidbit:
UPDATE: TMZ spoke with Al Sharpton's rep, Rachel Noerdlinger, who confirms Sharpton and Jackson were protesting Mottola in NY together in 2002 on July 6th and July 9th.

As the for the key date -- July 7th -- Sharpton's rep released the following curious statement:

We have reason to believe that Michael may have been in NY on the 7th and Rev. Sharpton will address this after he discusses it with the Jackson family.

Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/10/21/jacksons-will-randy-says-not-mjs-signature/#ixzz0UaxvTCNY

by 4evermichael71 Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:15 pm

does this go with "a fake of a fake is not a fraud" and therefore one more base covered so Michael won't get in trouble when he returns or am I over thinking as usual LOL

by See Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:16 pm

LOL didn't we figure that out already, some time ago .....
The plost does seem to thicken!!!

by MJhunny Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:17 pm

ishealive wrote:Hmmm the plot does thicken... So Randy is saying the will is fake - what's his motive for doing this!

was'nt there a court hearing scheduled for this thursday because
Katherine wants more executive responsability regarding the estate...

by ishealive Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:18 pm

4evermichael71 wrote:does this go with "a fake of a fake is not a fraud" and therefore one more base covered so Michael won't get in trouble when he returns or am I over thinking as usual LOL

I think you're right! this fits in very well with Souza's theory...

by NYMoonwalker Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:32 pm

.... This seemed like good news, but I woke up a bit more cynical than usual today. I feel like this really is turning into a murder investigation pale

by jpresley Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:36 pm

NYMoonwalker wrote: .... This seemed like good news, but I woke up a bit more cynical than usual today. I feel like this really is turning into a murder investigation

You're not alone (we are here w/ you), seems like a lot of folks woke up sad/cynical today. I still think this is good because it's playing out like we've been predicting.

by applesaucers Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:37 pm

We know, Randy. We know. =)

by NYMoonwalker Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:48 pm

jpresley wrote:
NYMoonwalker wrote: .... This seemed like good news, but I woke up a bit more cynical than usual today. I feel like this really is turning into a murder investigation

You're not alone (we are here w/ you), seems like a lot of folks woke up sad/cynical today. I still think this is good because it's playing out like we've been predicting.

Thank you

I guess maybe lots of us woke up feeling like this today because something really is going on and we're getting closer to the truth! You're right, I'm trying to be positive. It's all going according to plan. I'm just wondering why all these things are all coming up now. WE should detectives Cool

by city.gal1 Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:37 pm

The plot thickens MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Icon_eek

...wasn't there a MJ signature thread some time back?

by MJFoReVeRandAlways Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:42 pm

I´m really confused. I don´t believe he was murdered or anything like that, just confused.

by MJhunny Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:45 pm

http://www.free-press-release.com/news-michael-jackson-s-will-is-a-fraud-1254001017.html

no hours billed by the attorneys for that date eh...

by See Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:45 pm

Howard Weitzman is not telling the truth then...! Does he work for Sony or is he somehow related to Montella?????

by Thetruth Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:51 pm

The will have gone into probate, which means that it is real since their job is to test the authenticity of the document. However they could have been wrong and not enough proof to question the will... But this seems kind of far fetched, since John Branca and co and to be in on it.
But I most definitely don't belivie Michael was murdered

by neverlandprincess Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:52 pm

NYMoonwalker wrote:
jpresley wrote:
NYMoonwalker wrote: .... This seemed like good news, but I woke up a bit more cynical than usual today. I feel like this really is turning into a murder investigation

You're not alone (we are here w/ you), seems like a lot of folks woke up sad/cynical today. I still think this is good because it's playing out like we've been predicting.

Thank you I guess maybe lots of us woke up feeling like this today because something really is going on and we're getting closer to the truth! You're right, I'm trying to be positive. It's all going according to plan. I'm just wondering why all these things are all coming up now. WE should detectives

I swear if this is ever over I am gonna be a P.I. If anybody wants some laughter go over to the Meastro Lilyho thread-we had a blast last night. I woke up happy anyway MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Lol

MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Lol

NY-I know this is hard and I have went back and forth with the murder/hoax thing. One thing is certain ,when we have closure and the truth comes out (and it will) we can finally have peace and Michael will too. We are the ones keeping his legacy alive-not Jeramains' big plans-and we don't want to see his character tarnished anymore. I don't buy the drug story and no one else does either that ever actualy HEARD what he was saying throughout his life. With that said ...continue to seek the truth and we will find it.

by NYMoonwalker Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:52 pm

" From 1995-1998, Mr. Weitzman served as Executive Vice President, Corporate Operations for MCA (Universal Studios), where he was responsible for restructuring the corporate part of the business. Mr. Weitzman regularly counsels major corporations on contract and business strategies. "

Major corporations like...SONY??? Suspect

by mjssoulmate Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:53 pm

What would be the point of faking this will? Nobody but Katherine, the kids, and some undisclosed charities benefit from it. I would question it, if Sony, Joe, or Debbie had been beneficiaries; but they are not.
Is Randy getting pissed because he didn't get an allowance? I don't get it.

by neverlandprincess Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:53 pm

@4evermichael-I swear you must like that clip as much as I do(the new sig)

by See Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:56 pm

MJhunny wrote:http://www.free-press-release.com/news-michael-jackson-s-will-is-a-fraud-1254001017.html

no hours billed by the attorneys for that date eh...

Further evidence showing the 2002 will of Michael Jackson is a fraud is the denial of having other [color:d357=#000000! important][color:d357=#000000! important]children

as shown in the first paragraph of the will.

Based on the word of Joe???

by See Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:58 pm

mjssoulmate wrote:What would be the point of faking this will? Nobody but Katherine, the kids, and some undisclosed charities benefit from it. I would question it, if Sony, Joe, or Debbie had been beneficiaries; but they are not.
Is Randy getting pissed because he didn't get an allowance? I don't get it.

That is an interesting thought...

by Truth_or_Dare Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:02 pm

Thetruth wrote:The will have gone into probate, which means that it is real since their job is to test the authenticity of the document. However they could have been wrong and not enough proof to question the will... But this seems kind of far fetched, since John Branca and co and to be in on it.
But I most definitely don't belivie Michael was murdered

Why would they question? The lawyers I mean. They are IN the will. So they get paid. If they question it, they loose the job and the money that comes with it. Wink

by MJhunny Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:03 pm

See wrote:
MJhunny wrote:http://www.free-press-release.com/news-michael-jackson-s-will-is-a-fraud-1254001017.html

no hours billed by the attorneys for that date eh...

Further evidence showing the 2002 will of Michael Jackson is a fraud is the denial of having other [color:40fe=#000000! important][color:40fe=#000000! important]children</FONT></FONT>

as shown in the first paragraph of the will.

Based on the word of Joe???

True but what did happen to Omer Bhatti did'nt he say he was going to have a DNA test?? If, ofcourse he himself said that and it was'nt just made up by the tabloids...

by Truth_or_Dare Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:04 pm

mjssoulmate wrote:What would be the point of faking this will? Nobody but Katherine, the kids, and some undisclosed charities benefit from it. I would question it, if Sony, Joe, or Debbie had been beneficiaries; but they are not.
Is Randy getting pissed because he didn't get an allowance? I don't get it.

Because if they are getting their share ( the ones named in the will) than it's fraud if MJ is to come back.
If the will is fake, no fraud.
The fraud of a fraud... Wink

IMHO!

by NYMoonwalker Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:05 pm

neverlandprincess wrote:
NYMoonwalker wrote:
jpresley wrote:
NYMoonwalker wrote: .... This seemed like good news, but I woke up a bit more cynical than usual today. I feel like this really is turning into a murder investigation

You're not alone (we are here w/ you), seems like a lot of folks woke up sad/cynical today. I still think this is good because it's playing out like we've been predicting.

Thank you I guess maybe lots of us woke up feeling like this today because something really is going on and we're getting closer to the truth! You're right, I'm trying to be positive. It's all going according to plan. I'm just wondering why all these things are all coming up now. WE should detectives

I swear if this is ever over I am gonna be a P.I. If anybody wants some laughter go over to the Meastro Lilyho thread-we had a blast last night. I woke up happy anyway

NY-I know this is hard and I have went back and forth with the murder/hoax thing. One thing is certain ,when we have closure and the truth comes out (and it will) we can finally have peace and Michael will too. We are the ones keeping his legacy alive-not Jeramains' big plans-and we don't want to see his character tarnished anymore. I don't buy the drug story and no one else does either that ever actualy HEARD what he was saying throughout his life. With that said ...continue to seek the truth and we will find it.

Absolutely. That is exactly what I mean. Someday I'm not sure of what to believe anymore. All I know is that there are way too many inconsistencies for this all to be real. All I want is for the truth to come out and for someone to make everything come together and make sense. If Michael truly is..dead ( Sad

) or whether he is alive, I just want to know so that I can leave him alone. IMO, if he is alive, he has no intentions of coming back. And that is fine with me. I want him to be happy. But if he has truly passed away, then there is something seriously wrong with all of this. And that is what bugs me. I just want justice for him.

by neverlandprincess Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:11 pm

I THINK THE DNA test was a tabloid story.

by mjssoulmate Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:15 pm

Because if they are getting their share ( the ones named in the will) than it's fraud if MJ is to come back.
If the will is fake, no fraud.
The fraud of a fraud... MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Icon_wink

Even if they (the beneficiaries) were unaware that it was fraud?

by lou Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:17 pm

I woke up a bit sad today (and I noticed that it was not only me, wonder why...), but to me this news can be taken as a good sign.

by Truth_or_Dare Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:27 pm

mjssoulmate wrote:Because if they are getting their share ( the ones named in the will) than it's fraud if MJ is to come back.
If the will is fake, no fraud.
The fraud of a fraud...

Even if they (the beneficiaries) were unaware that it was fraud?

Yes, I think so. Maybe they wouldn't be held responsable but maybe they would have to pay back what they got. I'm not a lawyer so I don't know exactly how it works but that is what common sense tells me.

by Banessa Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:28 pm

jpresley wrote:
NYMoonwalker wrote: .... This seemed like good news, but I woke up a bit more cynical than usual today. I feel like this really is turning into a murder investigation

You're not alone (we are here w/ you), seems like a lot of folks woke up sad/cynical today. I still think this is good because it's playing out like we've been predicting.

Funny how after several weeks of us having said the will was fake because of the signature they are just now realizing it may be true! How come they didn't question this in the begining? I wonder if next Randy or someone else in the family will finally make a statement on how they now think Micheal is alive...again after we have all been saying this since the beginning!

We are just too good of detectives for them and apparently to quick in figuring out clues! MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Icon_cheers

by ilprincipe Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:31 pm

#1: TMZ -our beloved brickman- is FIRST with this story
# 2: Randy again? He becomes the part of a key player...I think I still overrate KO
and miss important parts of other persons like Randy
(Remember back in september....he complained about the heli-coverage at the funeral....some weeks later it was -pretty sure- debunked, that there was something going on in Culver City
instead of Forest Lawn)
#3 Why mentioning a campaign against Sony and Motolla?
==> Revenge?

Oh yes...I'm actually happy...this is good news.....

by Truth_or_Dare Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:33 pm

Banessa wrote:
jpresley wrote:
NYMoonwalker wrote: .... This seemed like good news, but I woke up a bit more cynical than usual today. I feel like this really is turning into a murder investigation

You're not alone (we are here w/ you), seems like a lot of folks woke up sad/cynical today. I still think this is good because it's playing out like we've been predicting.

Funny how after several weeks of us having said the will was fake because of the signature they are just now realizing it may be true! How come they didn't question this in the begining? I wonder if next Randy or someone else in the family will finally make a statement on how they now think Micheal is alive...again after we have all been saying this since the beginning!

We are just too good of detectives for them and apparently to quick in figuring out clues!

I think it's very likely!

by EarthAngel90 Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:42 pm

if the signature is fake , why say now ?!?!?! ......

by jpresley Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:46 pm

It's all confusing as hell and IMO that's the point. Nobody knows what is going on, what is the truth vs an outright lie and the story keeps unfolding nearly 4 months later with yet another delay. Branca and McClain aren't stupid, there is no way they would have proceeded as executors of Michael's estate unless (i) they truly believed themselves to be or, (ii) they knew the will was invalid, but were acting on Michael's authority to act as if it WERE valid until the appropriate time (this being the appropriate time, perhaps? lol). As far as KJ is concerned, well, again IMO she is aware of the hoax and playing a part plain and simple.

Another question regarding Al Sharpton, why did it take him 4 months to remember that Michael was w/ him in NY on the date in question?

UPDATE: TMZ spoke with Al Sharpton's rep, Rachel Noerdlinger, who confirms Sharpton and Jackson were protesting Mottola in NY together in 2002 on July 6th and July 9th.

As the for the key date -- July 7th -- Sharpton's rep released the following curious statement:

"We have reason to believe that Michael may have been in NY on the 7th and Rev. Sharpton will address this after he discusses it with the Jackson family."

Um, ok, so in all his dealings w/ the family during the memorial and all the initial uproar over the will and custody of the kids, etc, it never dawned on him that Michael signing any document in LA that date was impossible because he was NY? MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Icon_rolleyes

Shamone now! MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Suspect

Let's revisit the Jackson's initial resistance to the validity of this will back in June. In fighting it's veracity, why did this not come to light then? They were trying to debunk it and yet the very thing that would have succeeded in doing that, they simply missed?? MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Icon_study

That just doesn't make logical sense.

by emo_pinkt Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:46 pm

EarthAngel90 wrote:if the signature is fake , why say now ?!?!?! ......

Same thing I'm wondering. Also lets say that the will is fake, wont they have been smarter than that to set a different date. Something is definitely not right. Its seems almost too.....Obvious.

by neverlandprincess Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:49 pm

jpresley wrote:It's all confusing as hell and IMO that's the point. Nobody knows what is going on, what is the truth vs an outright lie and the story keeps unfolding nearly 4 months later with yet another delay. Branca and McClain aren't stupid, there is no way they would have proceeded as executors of Michael's estate unless (i) they truly believed themselves to be or, (ii) they knew the will was invalid, but were acting on Michael's authority to act as if it WERE valid until the appropriate time (this being the appropriate time, perhaps? lol). As far as KJ is concerned, well, again IMO she is aware of the hoax and playing a part plain and simple.

Another question regarding Al Sharpton, why did it take him 4 months to remember that Michael was w/ him in NY on the date in question?

UPDATE: TMZ spoke with Al Sharpton's rep, Rachel Noerdlinger, who confirms Sharpton and Jackson were protesting Mottola in NY together in 2002 on July 6th and July 9th.

As the for the key date -- July 7th -- Sharpton's rep released the following curious statement:

"We have reason to believe that Michael may have been in NY on the 7th and Rev. Sharpton will address this after he discusses it with the Jackson family."

Um, ok, so in all his dealings w/ the family during the memorial and all the initial uproar over the will and custody of the kids, etc, it never dawned on him that Michael signing any document in LA that date was impossible because he was NY? Shamone now!

Let's revisit the Jackson's initial resistance to the validity of this will back in June. In fighting it's veracity, why did this not come to light then? They were trying to debunk it and yet the very thing that would have succeeded in doing that, they simply missed?? That just doesn't make logical sense.

"Shamone-Tell me-Alright"!!!

by applesaucers Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:33 pm

I lurk everywhere. lol. Here's what I got from the KOP Discussion Board:

From the TMZ Live Chat:

Harvey is talking about it - said he spoke to Randy & said MJ was in NY.

Harvey
also spoke to Howard Weitzman (long time MJ lawyer & estate
attorney) said the witnesses were there to attest MJ signing it.

Harvey said there's an argument about location - but believes that regardless of location, this will NOT invalidate the will.

Harvey also said that the witnesses who saw MJ sign the will are the validation that the will needs to be valid.

Now... who were the witnesses?

Here's the will - the names of the witnesses were covered - but there are three witnesses who attest to the signing.

http://www.doyourownwill.com/Michael_Jackson_Will.pdf

Harvey said it doesn't matter WHERE he signed it, what matters are the witnesses who saw MJ sign the will.

by dancer1792 Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:45 pm

So the will's valididy is being questioned now? Why now after they have had the court hearing on the will?

If this one is really fake, what do you bet that somehow the lost will from 2007 (that half of the family claims he made) turns up. If there really is a 2007 will, we will be back to the drawing board, and have to repeat the same process over again. Good way to stall and distract everyone from what is really going on... MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Icon_wink

by marsheliamorgan Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:53 pm

i think this is another good question: according to al,HE has to talk to the jackson family FIRST before saying anything else? WHY? being you are who you are,why wouldnt you just come out with the TRUTH as you know it?unless,you are afraid of letting the cat out of the bag?

by dancer1792 Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:57 pm

marsheliamorgan wrote:i think this is another good question: according to al,HE has to talk to the jackson family FIRST before saying anything else? WHY? being you are who you are,why wouldnt you just come out with the TRUTH as you know it?unless,you are afraid of letting the cat out of the bag?

yeah, if it is the truth, what does it matter. Randy has already hinted at it being fake. Wouldn't you want to set the record straight?...unless he has something to hid, there was no reason he could not have said anything there and then. It was his account of what happened, not the family's.

by marsheliamorgan Wed Oct 21, 2009 4:04 pm

dancer,thanks for adding that,but,YOUR RIGHT,it is HIS account and why would have to confer with the family on HIS account?GREAT POINT,i didnt think of that Laughing

by applesaucers Wed Oct 21, 2009 4:11 pm

I just realized that July 7th = The Memorial. In LA. What time was the memorial?

... so does this mean he's in NY? IDK. IDK. Just assuming random things.

by Truth_or_Dare Wed Oct 21, 2009 4:30 pm

applesaucers wrote:I just realized that July 7th = The Memorial. In LA. What time was the memorial?

... so does this mean he's in NY? IDK. IDK. Just assuming random things.

Not this year! 2002, when the will was made.

by applesaucers Wed Oct 21, 2009 5:24 pm

Truth_or_Dare wrote:
applesaucers wrote:I just realized that July 7th = The Memorial. In LA. What time was the memorial?

... so does this mean he's in NY? IDK. IDK. Just assuming random things.

Not this year! 2002, when the will was made.

Lol. I know that. I was pointing out it was the same date as the memorial.

by Truth_or_Dare Wed Oct 21, 2009 5:25 pm

applesaucers wrote:
Truth_or_Dare wrote:
applesaucers wrote:I just realized that July 7th = The Memorial. In LA. What time was the memorial?

... so does this mean he's in NY? IDK. IDK. Just assuming random things.

Not this year! 2002, when the will was made.

Lol. I know that. I was pointing out it was the same date as the memorial.

Ohhh..sorry, kinda late for me Razz

Good point! MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Lol

by Kazumi Wed Oct 21, 2009 5:28 pm

hi guys, i'm new here so i dunno if i should be participating in this thread but i give it a try anyways...

I know this has been said before here, that the will being fake is related to his comeback so he doesn't get in trouble but even if the will is proven to be fake and he does come back, isn't faking one's own death considered a crime in the US? sorry if this question here sounds kind of stupid but I haven't been with time to read all posts (and there are a lot here) and me too I have been wandering from hoax suspicion to murder suspicion and back... MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Icon_redface

I didn't know what to believe anymore until tonight I read this and saw Dave Dave's interview - yeah US news get really late to Portugal MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Icon_neutral

by MJFoReVeRandAlways Wed Oct 21, 2009 5:30 pm

Kazumi wrote:hi guys, i'm new here so i dunno if i should be participating in this thread but i give it a try anyways...

I know this has been said before here, that the will being fake is related to his comeback so he doesn't get in trouble but even if the will is proven to be fake and he does come back, isn't faking one's own death considered a crime in the US? sorry if this question here sounds kind of stupid but I haven't been with time to read all posts (and there are a lot here) and me too I have been wandering from hoax suspicion to murder suspicion and back... I didn't know what to believe anymore until tonight I read this and saw Dave Dave's interview - yeah US news get really late to Portugal

Of course you should! Welcome and I hope you´ll enjoy. I really don´t know if it´s illegal, but as I have understood it he didn´t really commit a crime, because faking your death isn´t criminal. Maybe someone from the US knows better.

by Kazumi Wed Oct 21, 2009 5:35 pm

thanks !

i was really curious about that, let's see if someone can explain if MJ's comeback would mean he's get charged for a crime like faking his own death. Because I thought at a certain time that it might have been what's preventing him from coming back to us...

by dancer1792 Wed Oct 21, 2009 5:39 pm

Kazumi wrote:hi guys, i'm new here so i dunno if i should be participating in this thread but i give it a try anyways...

I know this has been said before here, that the will being fake is related to his comeback so he doesn't get in trouble but even if the will is proven to be fake and he does come back, isn't faking one's own death considered a crime in the US? sorry if this question here sounds kind of stupid but I haven't been with time to read all posts (and there are a lot here) and me too I have been wandering from hoax suspicion to murder suspicion and back... I didn't know what to believe anymore until tonight I read this and saw Dave Dave's interview - yeah US news get really late to Portugal

Faking your death is not necessarily a crime in the US. It only considered a crime if a person collects life insurance money or if the state pays for a search party or a memorial from taxpayer money. It is considered fraud and a person could go to jail for a while.

In the MJ case, life insurance has not been collected, there was no search party (he was not missing), and the memorial was paid from his estate (his own money). On top of all of this his death certificate has not been signed by a doctor the only person who can officially pernounce you dead.

So far, no laws have been broken. If MJ tomorrow says that he is alive, he has done nothing wrong in the eyes of the court. Some fans will be upset that he pulled this hoax, but lying is not a crime.

Don't feel bad about posting. It is a good question. MJ's will! Randy says it's not MJ's signature! Icon_smile

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