PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by neverlandsfairy on Sat Sep 05, 2009 5:58 pm

ditto
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by NikkiKat22 on Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:24 pm

This is the happiest I have been in a while cheers Thanks for posting!!!
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by MJ_Fan_For_40_yrs on Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:27 pm

I would also pay attention to when the fireman sets the cones.....
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by dunno_it on Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:35 pm

This is sooooo amazing!! Do you guys possibly have the youtube link to the interview with the guy who supposedly took the ambulance pic?? I'd like to compare it with these and probaly localise the photographer. I'd be very garteful!
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Banessa on Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:59 pm

Give.In.To.Me wrote:
All I can say is...GAME ON!!!

Girl!Right back at ya! I got chills watching this! Thanks for posting it!

Like someone said this is what we needed after the "burial" Very Happy cheers
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Pammy on Sat Sep 05, 2009 7:30 pm

Thanks for posting !

I also noticed that the fireman(or what ever he is lol) sets the cones WHEN the tourbus arrived ....and in the first part of the hollywood video the cones are already there when the ambulance backs out of MJ´s house ....also i think u cant see the guy in grey shirt who is makin a vid in first part of the hollywood vid..... my thought was that he is the one filming the second part ? I dunno....
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by jess.loves.mj on Sun Sep 06, 2009 2:55 am

rowdyangel wrote:Erm actually, I think I CAN see the tour bus when I froze the frame on the hollywood clip. Freeze at 1:37. The guy in red shirt is running directly towards the tourist bus. The tourist bus isn't huge, it reminds me of one of the Dolmus buses in Turkey but with an open top.

Sorry guys Crying or Very sad

JB.

I can see it too. Here is a screenshot I snapped (after trying for hours to pause it at the EXACT second I needed, hehehe)



You can clearly see the bus there (well I can anyway) and it is beside the fire engine. Sorry guys
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by MJfan777 on Sun Sep 06, 2009 3:28 am

i always said that... Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes




i had seen another video also ( i cant found it now) and the diference positions of the securities is very clear...

when i said there are two ambulances, some ppl just called me crazy Razz
we have double michael why not double ambulance
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Grace on Sun Sep 06, 2009 4:42 am

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Last edited by Grace on Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:34 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Grace on Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:00 am

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Last edited by Grace on Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by mommy on Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:42 am

mir26 wrote:</A></A></A></A>someone on mjhd made pics from both the video,s I will post them here too,in these pics you can clearly see the bus isent there where its supposed to be






http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif







[url=http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif
http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif[/quote[/url]]

Was just commenting on the cones. Didn't see it was there already.

I just thought of another thing, though. How many helicopters were in the air when MJ was taken to the coroners? I all of a sudden remember Jonell(?) having a different angle in her vid, when she comments on how many men are needed in the ambulace to lift a dead body? Its seen from the side, when all the other live footage was from behind. That would also fit with the green that got in the way on one of the pictures? Or am I wrong?


Last edited by mommy on Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:51 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Grace on Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:48 am

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Last edited by Grace on Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by mommy on Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:56 am

Do we know who the maker of the video is? Im thinking HMATclan alias HAT MAN clan???
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:56 am

rowdyangel wrote:Erm actually, I think I CAN see the tour bus when I froze the frame on the hollywood clip. Freeze at 1:37. The guy in red shirt is running directly towards the tourist bus. The tourist bus isn't huge, it reminds me of one of the Dolmus buses in Turkey but with an open top.

Sorry guys Crying or Very sad

JB.

Could indeed be so. From the front the tourbus looks a lot like the white van that passes right before it, so as much as I want this to be true, I can't say this is definite proof. Sad
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Bitten on Sun Sep 06, 2009 6:06 am

StenniZ wrote:
rowdyangel wrote:Erm actually, I think I CAN see the tour bus when I froze the frame on the hollywood clip. Freeze at 1:37. The guy in red shirt is running directly towards the tourist bus. The tourist bus isn't huge, it reminds me of one of the Dolmus buses in Turkey but with an open top.

Sorry guys Crying or Very sad

JB.

Could indeed be so. From the front the tourbus looks a lot like the white van that passes right before it, so as much as I want this to be true, I can't say this is definite proof. Sad

Yes, I also see it. But it's so small... To me the tourbus look more narrow than a car..? But the pointy things on top of the van could be people.. Arrh, I don't know..
But still it does not explain how the cameraman (in black shirt) could film the right side of the ambulance, when he ran in the opposite position..
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by rowdyangel on Sun Sep 06, 2009 6:26 am

OMG! This is soooo confusing Crying or Very sad

I can definately see the tour bus (thanks for snapshotting that jess.loves.mj) but I can also see the difference in the shadows from the trees. Agh! My head is going to explode!!

Still think it's dodgy - like someone else said, why no police officers? And that tour bus - I would have thought that the road would have been closed off or something.

I just don't get it.

JB.
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Grace on Sun Sep 06, 2009 6:28 am

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Last edited by Grace on Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:32 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by CharlieBarley on Sun Sep 06, 2009 6:52 am

I have just been watching both videos together. I agree the image posted does show the bus was in-fact there.

BUT the guy in the black T-shirt(camera man) does not manage to get around to the side of the ambulance. Their are 3 men that are at the side of the ambulance-

1st Man fire engine man 2nd red t-shirt man 3rd cream t-shirt man. The camera man the guy in the black t-shirt does not make it in time to side of the ambulance but the video shows he does.

Also watching the 1st video, I kept pausing it as the ambulance reversed the pap guys were at the side it looks like they had a second to take a picture and they look like there running away before they are really taking anything. I really think it is unlikely they got a shot it happens that quick, which makes me think all the more that the picture of MJ in the ambulance is fake.
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by jess.loves.mj on Sun Sep 06, 2009 7:15 am

rowdyangel wrote:OMG! This is soooo confusing Crying or Very sad

I can definately see the tour bus (thanks for snapshotting that jess.loves.mj) but I can also see the difference in the shadows from the trees. Agh! My head is going to explode!!

Still think it's dodgy - like someone else said, why no police officers? And that tour bus - I would have thought that the road would have been closed off or something.

I just don't get it.

JB.

No problem Very Happy

I hadn't noticed the tree shadows earlier... Just when I think I have worked out explanations for all the "oddities", someone throws a new one in Wink
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by yaya on Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:45 am

hey guys,
part 2 of the video has been uploaded on youtube. you should check it out; it's just as interesting as the first one!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hP8X--Fo2KA&feature=sub
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:21 pm

yaya wrote:hey guys,
part 2 of the video has been uploaded on youtube. you should check it out; it's just as interesting as the first one!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hP8X--Fo2KA&feature=sub

As much as I believe in the hoax, I honestly must say, that this second video is too inconclusive. For one, the quality of the videos is too low, to give any guarantee about those reflectors being there or not. As the poster states, the reflectors are of a red color and light up yellow when light falls upon them. This I can understand and believe, but to say that the reflector is not there in the paparazzi-video.....nah...too far away from the ambulance to be sure about that. Plus the part where he says that the perfectly round red reflector on the bumper turns oval-shaped in the paparazzi-video is because the camera is filming a photo of that scene and it does so at an angle, making the reflectors shape change (or better said...appear to change). Gonna look into the rest of the video now.

If only they had shot everything as crispyclear in HD like some parts off the funeral and memorial. Laughing
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by yaya on Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:24 pm

i agree about the shadows and the shape of the round reflector that appears to be oblong. i thought the thing about the hubcaps on the tires was the best part! very convincing, imo.
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:36 pm

yaya wrote:i agree about the shadows and the shape of the round reflector that appears to be oblong. i thought the thing about the hubcaps on the tires was the best part! very convincing, imo.

The shadows I can agree on. But the problem with the reflector being oblong in the paparazzi-video is because he uses the video where a camera is filming a photograph. This photograph was taken from quite a distance and a low viewpoint. This results in a fisheye-effect (distorted cameraview and thus distorted picture). On top of that they (at the paparazzi's office) film the already distorted video, making it even harder to determine the actual shape of the reflector.

The part about the wheels makes sense though IMO, so I still believe!!! Smile (not that a couple of rimms have much influence on my faith...lol! but yeah, this is something to further investigate.

By the way....now that I've watched the interview with this paparazzi-schmuck again, he seems more and more FAKE! What a poser. IMO he's acting, like most participants in this 'thing'!
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by ezzramj on Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:47 pm

hi everybody i'm ezzramj. i love this blog and i too believe that mj didn't die on the 25/06. i actually just want to point out (although many of us know it) that some of mj's siblings are cashing in on his death by releasing new songs and organising tribute concerts. maybe we can boycott them by simply ignoring them and avoid mentioning them in the blogs, they crave media attention and it's up to us to make sure they don't succeed in making $ on our beloved angel's back. also the note written in the BOOK by one of the sisters proves just how much she wants the attention!!!! we should not allow them to make money,
we love you angel, you know we do, and we know that you love us
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:53 pm

ezzramj wrote:hi everybody i'm ezzramj. i love this blog and i too believe that mj didn't die on the 25/06. i actually just want to point out (although many of us know it) that some of mj's siblings are cashing in on his death by releasing new songs and organising tribute concerts. maybe we can boycott them by simply ignoring them and avoid mentioning them in the blogs, they crave media attention and it's up to us to make sure they don't succeed in making $ on our beloved angel's back. also the note written in the BOOK by one of the sisters proves just how much she wants the attention!!!! we should not allow them to make money,
we love you angel, you know we do, and we know that you love us

Hi ezzramj,

I think you're right, but we're such a small percentage of the global population, that I doubt it'll make a difference. Besides that...if in the end we turn out to be right about the hoax and MJ is resurrected, I think the siblings will get their share.......and then some! If that happens, I doubt eny of them will ever sell another album or even a kidney again! ;-)

Welcome to the forum btw! Enjoy and be nice! Wink
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by ezzramj on Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:58 pm

hi again!!! thx for your insights, i do not mean to be nasty!!! it just kills me to think they're making money over our beloved mj. we, the fans, have loved him unconditionaly never wanting anything in return but to know that he will continue to rock our world as he has done for over 40yrs. we love him no matter what
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Wed Sep 09, 2009 1:05 pm

ezzramj wrote:hi again!!! thx for your insights, i do not mean to be nasty!!! it just kills me to think they're making money over our beloved mj. we, the fans, have loved him unconditionaly never wanting anything in return but to know that he will continue to rock our world as he has done for over 40yrs. we love him no matter what

Nasty is not always bad! Wink hahaha No worries, I totally agreed with you. Smile But keep in mind, that no matter what happens...MJ's not just doing this for himself. We, the fans play a big part in this hoax (if it turns out to be true). He wants US to finally see how corrupt media have become and how they lie to us. I even think, that if we all turn out to be wrong about the hoax, we still have learned a very important lesson not to trust the media! Hoax or not. Thanks for your input and welcome to the family! Wink
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Human_nature on Thu Sep 10, 2009 3:16 am

"Wherever. Whatever. Have a nice day."


Last edited by Human_nature on Wed Sep 16, 2009 7:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by ezzramj on Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:36 am

hi everybody, just home from work and as many of us i guess, i spent the day thinking of MJ!!! and i thought of this: so we all agree that the ambulance video could be fake, we all agree that the coronor's van episode could be a hoax within the hoax, the ambulance pic is almost 100% fake, this is it pic was photo shopped, etc etc etc, but have any of us actually seen any pictures taken by paparazzi who said themselves that they'd been staking out MJ's for the past few weeks prior to his "death" maybe leaving the house or returning from "rehearsals"????? i haven't seen a single one, and knowing the paparazzi there should have been hundreds of pictures.. can anyone answer on that???
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by rowdyangel on Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:39 am

ezzramj wrote:hi everybody, just home from work and as many of us i guess, i spent the day thinking of MJ!!! and i thought of this: so we all agree that the ambulance video could be fake, we all agree that the coronor's van episode could be a hoax within the hoax, the ambulance pic is almost 100% fake, this is it pic was photo shopped, etc etc etc, but have any of us actually seen any pictures taken by paparazzi who said themselves that they'd been staking out MJ's for the past few weeks prior to his "death" maybe leaving the house or returning from "rehearsals"????? i haven't seen a single one, and knowing the paparazzi there should have been hundreds of pictures.. can anyone answer on that???

So it's possible that Michael was not at that house for weeks (maybe even months) leading to his (cough) 'death'?? I'd never thought about that. Maybe he was 'gone' long ago??

JB.
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by ezzramj on Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:47 am

i don't really know what it means or if it proves anything, i just think it's very strange that the paparazzi themselves say they were staking out the house for weeks, yet there are no pics or footage to show us MJ leaving or returning to the house??? strange!!! stranger yet: the so called biographer ian halperin or whatever he calls himself, says in his book that MJ was sick, in need of lung transplant, skin disease, etc,.... but that doesn't fit with everything about the "rehearsals" or MJ being okayed by doctors for the "this is it"..... he should be dragged out into the public and be made to lay down proof of everything he says, and if he can provide the proof then the docs that okayed MJ for the london gigs are gonna be in a shit load of trouble for supplying false info, thus faking for insurance claims!!! it is very confusing, but each day that goes by is a day bringing us closer to the truth, someone is lying, and not doing a very good job of it, love to all, and all our love to our MAN IN THE MIRROR....love u always MJ
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by dunno_it on Thu Sep 10, 2009 5:41 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8iw4DknNG8&feature=channel_page
the third part of the death of a moonwalker. It seems to be the best, watch it and tell me what you guys think:)
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Guest on Thu Sep 10, 2009 6:13 pm

ezzramj wrote:hi everybody, just home from work and as many of us i guess, i spent the day thinking of MJ!!! and i thought of this: so we all agree that the ambulance video could be fake, we all agree that the coronor's van episode could be a hoax within the hoax, the ambulance pic is almost 100% fake, this is it pic was photo shopped, etc etc etc, but have any of us actually seen any pictures taken by paparazzi who said themselves that they'd been staking out MJ's for the past few weeks prior to his "death" maybe leaving the house or returning from "rehearsals"????? i haven't seen a single one, and knowing the paparazzi there should have been hundreds of pictures.. can anyone answer on that???


I cant, cause im just as confused as you are

Guest
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Red Velvet on Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:02 am

I had posted this thought in the incorrect thread at first. Its about the red car (and sorry if someone mentioned it in another thread already)

I'd like to know what u think, those of u who know something about photoshopping and such, what u think of this.

if the camera lens was flush against the ambulance glass, then the red car reflection wouldn't have been in 3-D, right? because the two glass together (camera lens and ambulance window) would have 'acted' as 'one' glass ...right?

if the camera lens captured the red car, especially as clearly as it did, wouldn't it would have had to have been, say, a quarter inch off the glass?

and if it was, then it wouldn't have captured such a crisp clear pic of Michael, right?

if you take the picture of the glass and photoshop a pic of MJ's head from the chamber photo ..

well..but where would u find the upper torso?

a close look shows the uneven skin blotches

are there any pics of his skin someplace where they could have added that and made it look like it goes with the head?

i realize it may be far fetched though ...unless those professionals might have some pretty advanced equipment, right?
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:32 am

Red Velvet wrote:I had posted this thought in the incorrect thread at first. Its about the red car (and sorry if someone mentioned it in another thread already)

I'd like to know what u think, those of u who know something about photoshopping and such, what u think of this.

if the camera lens was flush against the ambulance glass, then the red car reflection wouldn't have been in 3-D, right? because the two glass together (camera lens and ambulance window) would have 'acted' as 'one' glass ...right?

if the camera lens captured the red car, especially as clearly as it did, wouldn't it would have had to have been, say, a quarter inch off the glass?

and if it was, then it wouldn't have captured such a crisp clear pic of Michael, right?

if you take the picture of the glass and photoshop a pic of MJ's head from the chamber photo ..

well..but where would u find the upper torso?

a close look shows the uneven skin blotches

are there any pics of his skin someplace where they could have added that and made it look like it goes with the head?

i realize it may be far fetched though ...unless those professionals might have some pretty advanced equipment, right?

I understand what you mean and I don't think it's far fetched at all. But before we start thinking about this, I'ld like to remind you of the following:

The red car (in my and many others' opinion) could not have been in the picture at all. It was standing (parked) alongside the road. However, the paparazzi-guy, that took the alleged photo took the picture when the ambulance was positioned at (almost) a 90degree angle (compared to the red car and all others for that matter). If anything would have reflected in the window, it would have been ROAD, not sidewalk (and cars).

The fact that the car doesn't appear in "3D" like you say, is most likely because it was edited over the pic afterwards. Therefor it didn't become 'part' of the picture. So in my opinion you're right. Smile ....or were you saying the opposite? Smile
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Red Velvet on Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:58 am

StenniZ wrote:
Red Velvet wrote:I had posted this thought in the incorrect thread at first. Its about the red car (and sorry if someone mentioned it in another thread already)

I'd like to know what u think, those of u who know something about photoshopping and such, what u think of this.

if the camera lens was flush against the ambulance glass, then the red car reflection wouldn't have been in 3-D, right? because the two glass together (camera lens and ambulance window) would have 'acted' as 'one' glass ...right?

if the camera lens captured the red car, especially as clearly as it did, wouldn't it would have had to have been, say, a quarter inch off the glass?

and if it was, then it wouldn't have captured such a crisp clear pic of Michael, right?

if you take the picture of the glass and photoshop a pic of MJ's head from the chamber photo ..

well..but where would u find the upper torso?

a close look shows the uneven skin blotches

are there any pics of his skin someplace where they could have added that and made it look like it goes with the head?

i realize it may be far fetched though ...unless those professionals might have some pretty advanced equipment, right?

I understand what you mean and I don't think it's far fetched at all. But before we start thinking about this, I'ld like to remind you of the following:

The red car (in my and many others' opinion) could not have been in the picture at all. It was standing (parked) alongside the road. However, the paparazzi-guy, that took the alleged photo took the picture when the ambulance was positioned at (almost) a 90degree angle (compared to the red car and all others for that matter). If anything would have reflected in the window, it would have been ROAD, not sidewalk (and cars).

The fact that the car doesn't appear in "3D" like you say, is most likely because it was edited over the pic afterwards. Therefor it didn't become 'part' of the picture. So in my opinion you're right. Smile ....or were you saying the opposite? Smile

OK, well, let me make sure I understand what you're saying.

I'm going to have to say it my way lol because when you guys talk about the 90 degree angle thingy it loses me lol sorry

Is this another way of saying it :

well first let me address one other thing ..

from 00:15 seconds when the ambulance begins backing out of the driveway, to the time it actually takes off, there is no opportunity for anyone to have snapped the pic of MJ simply because we actually are watching this continuous bit of footage and the ambulance isn't standing still long enough, plus the fact that there is no one taking a picture? That's what I see.

About the red car : are you saying the red car would have had to have been parked in front of the driveway (on the other side of the street), perpindicular to the back of the ambulance and that based on the footage, it isn't there? .. only street is there?

If that's what you're saying, I'm wondering where that red car is, because its in the shot where the camera is shaking.

Where do you guys think the red car was parked? or is it not really relevant since we can clearly see that no one is taking any pictures of MJ while the ambulance is on the street?

sorry ... I'm not as swift as you guys Laughing

btw, here's the Hollywood Video footage for easy reference:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5MpdLwjNs0&feature=related
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Red Velvet on Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:06 am

oh wait! I (think) I get it now!

Looking at this Starline Tourist video I think I see what you mean.

Are you saying the red car would have had to have been parked at a Right angle like say, alongside the trash dispensers for the guy in the red shirt to have taken that picture reflecting the red car? If so, I see what you mean, because the ambulance too off straight-way and there is no car there.

here's the tour bus video for easy reference:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_VWCpIgrJI&feature=related
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Red Velvet on Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:08 am

Do you think another relevant thing is the fact that on the tour bus video there seems to be a lot more people and a lot more traffic?

At first I thought that since the Hollywood phtographer was so much closer could be the reason he got the security guy's hand on the window as the ambulance was backing, but that other guy is all up on the back of the ambulance also and there is none of that 'extra' activity from him in the Hollywood video.

Do you think that's relevant also? or do you think its a perspective thing somehow?

Smile thanks for helping me btw
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:26 am

Red Velvet wrote:OK, well, let me make sure I understand what you're saying.

I'm going to have to say it my way lol because when you guys talk about the 90 degree angle thingy it loses me lol sorry

Is this another way of saying it :

well first let me address one other thing ..

from 00:15 seconds when the ambulance begins backing out of the driveway, to the time it actually takes off, there is no opportunity for anyone to have snapped the pic of MJ simply because we actually are watching this continuous bit of footage and the ambulance isn't standing still long enough, plus the fact that there is no one taking a picture? That's what I see.

About the red car : are you saying the red car would have had to have been parked in front of the driveway (on the other side of the street), perpindicular to the back of the ambulance and that based on the footage, it isn't there? .. only street is there?

If that's what you're saying, I'm wondering where that red car is, because its in the shot where the camera is shaking.

Where do you guys think the red car was parked? or is it not really relevant since we can clearly see that no one is taking any pictures of MJ while the ambulance is on the street?

sorry ... I'm not as swift as you guys Laughing

Yes, that's what I mean. Smile

Allthough I think the red car COULD have been reflected in the window, I'm not convinced it would have reflected the way it appears in the pic. Looking at the picture, it seems as if the red car was aligned with the ambulance (and window) (so standing next to eachother). However, judging from what I can see in the video, it seems to be at an angle and more to the back of the ambulance (when the pic is supposedly taken). You are right, that because of the shaking camera it's hard to prove this.

I tried to make a sketch from above. Don't judge please, allthough I'm pretty good at using Photoshop, I totally can't draw. lol!



Regardless of all the above, I think it was totally impossible for the photog to have taken the pic, the way they claim he did it. Besides that they put too much emphasis on him taking the picture by shoving the video of the guy filming the photog. So they were more concerned about proving he HAD taken the pic. If only they had put that much work in creating a believable picture.

Damn, it's hard to explain. Wink But if we keep going like this, I'm sure we'll get there. Smile
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:30 am

Red Velvet wrote:Do you think another relevant thing is the fact that on the tour bus video there seems to be a lot more people and a lot more traffic?

At first I thought that since the Hollywood phtographer was so much closer could be the reason he got the security guy's hand on the window as the ambulance was backing, but that other guy is all up on the back of the ambulance also and there is none of that 'extra' activity from him in the Hollywood video.

Do you think that's relevant also? or do you think its a perspective thing somehow?

Smile thanks for helping me btw

I think the comparison of the different takes on this video (all recordings are supposed to be from the exact same moment in time) is very important. I took screenshots from all three videos (photogs, hollywood-tv and tourbus if I'm not mistaken) and what caught my attention is that the lighting is different (thus different times of recording). For instance: In two videos, we get to see the ambulance leaving and in the background, the trashcans are visible. I put the screenshots on top of eachother, aligning the trashcans. When I did that, several other things (cracks in the road, firetruck, pilons and sidewalks and a lot of shadows from trees and such) did not match/align. I'm still working on this, because I want to make sure I covered all grounds and not to make a fool of myself. Wink
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Red Velvet on Fri Sep 11, 2009 12:26 pm

That drawing is EXCELLENT! Thanks for doing that. I think the comparisons are very important too. Something about all that street activity in the tour video and non of that in the Hollywood video is really getting my attention right now. I'm still pondering and comparing that stuff as well.
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by dunno_it on Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:08 pm

Stenni and Red Velvet, thank you so much for your accounts, now i'm starting to understand the whole thing with the red car, Stenni, now i'm really looking forward to your posting the screenshots, boy, this is so interesting! And I am also looking forward to your opinions on the third part of the death of a Moonwalker...Is it possible for the camera man to be still filming the ambulance whent it was already gone?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8iw4DknNG8&feature=channel_page
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by MiaPaparazzi on Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:25 pm

OK I am a photog and I have been looking at all this over and over again to figure out HOW the red car is in the pic. I can't. There is NO way, NO how that car is reflected in the picture like they show. First the flash has to either bounce THROUGH the tint (which acts as a reflector in a way, remember this!) and the only way to do that is to have the camera lens up against the glass OR use no flash and hope the sunlight is enough to see through tint (which it is not). As for the angle in comparison to the shot and photog and ambulance... it won't work. I am planning on trying to re-construct (not using ambulance ha ha) and trying to see if I can re-create something relatively similar.... I dont think it is possible though. IMO the car was photoshopped in for 1 reason:


It is a distraction to the eye




(wondering why I put the stars in the post? did they DISTRACT you from what I wrote in any way? )
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by ezzramj on Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:28 pm

very good possibility!!! the distraction thing. can anyone say why there are no pictures leaving or coming from the house, coz paparazzi say they were staking the house for weeks prior to the alleged death of MJ. shouldn't there be hundreds of pics or at least video footage??? btw the red car is seen, but why not the photographer who took the alleged pic????
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:55 pm

Red Velvet wrote:oh wait! I (think) I get it now!

Looking at this Starline Tourist video I think I see what you mean.

Are you saying the red car would have had to have been parked at a Right angle like say, alongside the trash dispensers for the guy in the red shirt to have taken that picture reflecting the red car? If so, I see what you mean, because the ambulance too off straight-way and there is no car there.

here's the tour bus video for easy reference:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_VWCpIgrJI&feature=related

Precisely. In my opinion, the red car was parked too far back and should have been more in one line with the trashcans for it to reflect in the ambulance's window, the way it did. Smile
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:57 pm

dunno_it wrote:Stenni and Red Velvet, thank you so much for your accounts, now i'm starting to understand the whole thing with the red car, Stenni, now i'm really looking forward to your posting the screenshots, boy, this is so interesting! And I am also looking forward to your opinions on the third part of the death of a Moonwalker...Is it possible for the camera man to be still filming the ambulance whent it was already gone?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8iw4DknNG8&feature=channel_page


Hahahaha you're very very welcome. Glad you liked it. Wink I'm gonna work on those screenshots again tomorrow. I must admit, I planned on not visiting the ofurm this weekend, but it's way too exciting. Smile As soon as I'm done with it, I'll start a topic in the Pictures-section. Smile
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by StenniZ on Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:01 pm

MiaPaparazzi wrote: OK I am a photog and I have been looking at all this over and over again to figure out HOW the red car is in the pic. I can't. There is NO way, NO how that car is reflected in the picture like they show. First the flash has to either bounce THROUGH the tint (which acts as a reflector in a way, remember this!) and the only way to do that is to have the camera lens up against the glass OR use no flash and hope the sunlight is enough to see through tint (which it is not). As for the angle in comparison to the shot and photog and ambulance... it won't work. I am planning on trying to re-construct (not using ambulance ha ha) and trying to see if I can re-create something relatively similar.... I dont think it is possible though. IMO the car was photoshopped in for 1 reason:


It is a distraction to the eye




(wondering why I put the stars in the post? did they DISTRACT you from what I wrote in any way? )

I think so too. It's more like they needed something that would work as a kind of "filter", to make it harder to see that the picture is a fake. So I think the red car first "appeared" in the photo and afterwards (when the video of the ambulance was shot) they parked the red car at that position. That also would explain, why they were so desperate to prove (with the paparazzi's filming), that the guy was there taking the picture. And also the reason for the ambulance to drive out of the driveway backwards in slowmotion.

So first there was the picture....then they had to (re)create the or a situation in which we would believe the picture could/would have been taken....am I still making sense? lol Wink
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Red Velvet on Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:39 pm

No you are making perfect sense to me StenniZ. I agree with you and mia on the 'filter'/'distraction' thing. I wasn't aware that they actually went to the bother of moving the red car, because I was thinking that may have been one reason they had the camera shaking with the red car in there. To give the "illusion" to anyone who would look closer, of plausibility that the red car was 'there' to be seen in the reflection as so many of us first thought.

Also, I agree with mia about the flash bouncing off if they did use a flash. In all fairness to the possibility, I was wondering if perhaps paps cameras may have some sort of 'infrared' type of 'flash' that could capture a clear pic through a smoke glass. MiaPapparrazzi do you know? Nonetheless, this pic is STILL a fake. Mostly because this is so 80s MJ it ain't even funny (well, yes it is, a little, actually lol)

Also, just to take a quick break from the red car (and I do get right back to it below) this may seem off topic but as long as we're talking about this guy, please allow me to let you know that I feel that this interview with this papparrazzi said an awful LOT, at least about what was NOT going on (eg., there was no real emergency).

I just can't get over this and I'd love for you guys to check this out by listening very carefully starting at 1:55 when he's answering the interviewer's question about what happened within the hours following the terrible "news" and tell me what you think.

Starting at 1:55 listen very carefully :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VR-HSc2aM4




My observation of it is below :




He says he'd been following MJ for 10 years and going to hospitals was just part of the MJ routine.

This time, of ALL times, after they got the shot of MJ unconsious in the ambulance - instead of following MJ to the hospital like he'd been doing for 10 YEARS, he went to the office to THE INTERNET

and CHECKED TMZ

huhhhhhhh?????????????????????????????????????????

First of all, 10 years of doing anything is what could definitely be called AN AUTOMATIC 'HABIT PATTERN'

And regardless to HOW many times he'd done it, he still had first shot at an exclusive, as a papparazzi photographer.

Now, here he is, seeing with his VERY OWN EYES, MJ leaving his house in an AMBULANCE

and this PAPPARAZZI goes ...


WHERE??????????


the hospital of course, right ????????????


NO


Back to "the office" !!


When the video starts out, he's narrating the pictures of MJ that the interviewer is looking at, and the pap is saying that in this one particular picture they followed Michael from the doctor's office to the antique store (then MIND YOU - he BRAGS about being the ONLY agency there).

So, NOW he wants us to believe that when MJ is whisked from his OWN HOME, UNCONSCIOUS in an AMBULANCE, this guy does NOT follow him to the HOSPITAL!

WAIT a minute !!!

Weren't they the ONLY agency there THIS TIME TOO??????

So then, WHY didn't he follow the ambulance?

What more important place does he have to go?

THE OFFICE.

Why would he go to the office? He says that 1/2 (one HALF!!) an hour later he was back AT THE OFFICE


ON THE INTERNET!!

CHECKING TMZ!!!!!

HUH???????

Wait a minute.

HOW could this be?

HOW COULD ANY SELF-RESPECTING PAPP BE CHECKING TMZ for something he'd just left the scene of and seen with his OWN EYES and could have had 1st hand exclusive of, AT THE very HOSPITAL itself?

WHY could this be?

Could it be that his "assignment"/"agreement" was to go to MJ'S house and photograph the "staged" ambulance scene and report/return back to the office to continue the next phase of "the project"? or at least "show up" to seem to have photographed it?

Didn't he even CARE (as a ten year MJ/hospital veteran) what was going on at the hospital? Does his ten years of following MJ include MJ being taken away in an ambulance not even conscious? In other words, with as many times as MJ had been to the hospital over the last 10 years, how many times did it happen where MJ was whisked away from his own home unconscious???

none?

Just what I thought.

So what made this time less attractive/interesting instead of more?

Mind you, he went to the office, jumped on the internet and checked TMZ!!! when he had just been there in PERSON HIMSELF

Notice his TMZ plug casually tossed in there?

Remember that TMZ broke this story before anyone knew anything?

I get the feeling this interview was an ooooooops.

A story in itself :

EXCLUSIVE !!!

Papparazzi sees MJ leaving his own home unconscious in an ambulance and the pap goes in the opposite direction to some boring old air conditioned OFFICE instead of following the ambulance to the hospital.


I know its a bit off topic from the ambulance but then again, further proof that the whole ambulance scene was a FAKE

OK, BACK TO THE RED CAR.

Please correct me if I'm making this out to be too simple by saying this but at the beginning of the tour bus video it shows the street completely clear on both sides (where the trash despensers are and across the street from them.

Before the video actually begins is a clear shot of the street.

As soon as the video starts hit pause :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_VWCpIgrJI&feature=related

You can see both sides of the street, clear around the curve, right up to the time the ambulance backs out and takes off.

Is this relevant as it seems?


Last edited by Red Velvet on Mon Sep 14, 2009 10:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

Post by Give.In.To.Me on Mon Sep 14, 2009 10:07 pm

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Re: PROOF of an ambulance video hoax?? maybe!

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