Propofol/Diprivan - The Media Story vs. Facts

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Post by annieisnotokey on Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:27 pm

@Everybody,

In the past few days I’ve been doing some research about propofol / Diprivan in order to contrast the media story with some facts about that substance. I’ve compiled in this post what the media says (I wrote three little summaries of the most reported stories), facts about propofol / Diprivan that I found online and my comments. The sources where I found the facts about propofol / Diprivan can be found at the end of my post.

Please be warned that I’m not a medical professional. What I’m posting here is the result of my best and honest effort to understand the information I researched and contrast it with the media story. Nothing more and nothing less.

I know it’s long and it may be a bit boring, but I totally think it’s worth a look, so please read on:

MEDIA SAYS: Michael Jackson, already having a serious addiction to pain killers (oxycotin, vicodin, demerol) and anxiety medicines (xanax, diazepam) was also a cronic insomniac. He used the drug diprivan/propofol in the past (late 90s) to sleep after the excitement of live performances and, because of the stress of the upcoming shows, he sought out the same solution. Some reports say he was addicted to this substance.

FACT: “Propofol provides loss of awareness for short diagnostic tests and surgical procedures, sleep at the beginning of surgery,
and supplements other types of general anesthetics.”

COMMENT: Therefore, if it’s normally used for short procedures, I don’t think it would be the drug of choice to obtain 8 hour-sleep-nights.

FACT: “What drug(s) may interact with propofol? Alcohol, barbiturate medicines for inducing sleep or treating seizures (convulsions), herbal products, including St. John's wort, medicines for anxiety or sleeping problems, such as diazepam or
temazepam, medicines for colds, breathing difficulties, or weight loss, medicines for mental problems and psychotic disturbances, medicines for pain.”

COMMENT: Researching what type of drugs interact with propofol takes about 5 minutes. If MJ didn’t know better, the doctor should have. If it is at all true that MJ was taking pain and anxiety medication nobody in their right mind should combine them with
propofol.


FACT: Patient Information: Advise patient that mental alertness, coordination, and physical dexterity may be impaired for some time after administration.
COMMENT: If MJ was relying on propofol to sleep at nights, he wouldn’t have been able to rehearse, dance, sing, etc. the next morning.

FACT: Treating sleep disorders is not an approved use of the drug.
FACT: There are zero circumstances where propofol should ever be used for insomnia.
FACT: The drug itself does not provide pain relief.
COMMENT: The standard and approved use of the drug wouldn’t provide what apparently MJ was looking for, either overcoming insomnia and/or pain relief.

FACT: Anesthetic doses are not described as possibly having an abuse potential.
FACT: There have been cases of health care professionals self-administering the drug and abusing it, however, said Vila, who has examined deaths from Diprivan in Florida.
COMMENT: It is true that there are addicts who are addicted to anesthetics. The majority of them belong to the medical field, for obvious reasons. There is a specific scientific survey/study published about addiction to propofol: http://www.anesthesia-analgesia.org/cgi/reprint/105/4/1066.pdf
This study is very clear: propofol addiction only presents itself with subanesthetic doses. That is, enough to give you a
buzz, but not enough to knock you out. If MJ was using propofol as it was portrayed by the media, that is to be knocked out for hours, it means the substance was used in anesthetic dosages and that is not considered to have abuse/addiction potential. In conclusion, even if I can't tell you if MJ was addicted to certain painkillers or not, it is hard to believe that he was addicted to Propofol/Diprivan the way is depicted by the media, because it doesn't normally happen.


MEDIA SAYS: Initially, he asked Nurse Cherylin Lee to get this drug for him and she ethically refused to. However, a few days later didn’t hesitate to tell the world about it. Finally, Dr. Conrad Murray - a cardiologist and not a licensed anesthesiologist- agreed to provide the drug for him, every night, to help sleep and be fresh for rehearsals. Despite earning U$D 150,000 a month and having the world’s most famous star as a patient, he relied on not falling asleep to monitor the administration of propofol. Unfortunately, something went horribly wrong on June 25th and because Dr. Murray failed to properly monitor him (fell asleep, wasn’t in the room, didn’t know that MJ had already taken other medications, etc.) and / or didn’t have the necessary equipment to bring him back, the legendary King of Pop died.

FACT: prescription is necessary, one most not to use Diprivan without a valid prescription.
COMMENT: Nurse Cherylin Lee wouldn’t have been able to obtain propofol because she is not able to prescribe it.

FACT: It is given by trained anesthesia professionals in a controlled environment.
FACT: Should be administered only by personnel who are trained in administration of general anesthesia and familiar with drug.
Administer only in settings in which resuscitation equipment is immediately available.

FACT: Deaths from the drug have occurred when administered by non-anesthetist professionals, in settings such as ophthalmology, gynecology and plastic surgery.
FACT: Over dosage symptoms: Cardio respiratory and Cardiovascular depression.
COMMENT: What doctor in their right mind, no matter how incompetent, would administer propofol in a non controlled setting and without proper equipment when all this information is readily available? And why would MJ hire a cardiologist instead of a trained anesthesia professional to provide this ‘off the wall’ insomnia treatment?

MEDIA SAYS: After 30 hours of not knowing his whereabouts, Dr. Murray -not as a suspect, but as a witness- gave the police a detailed account of the facts and circumstances surrounding the death and even informed them where to find dozens of bottles of diprivan inside a closet in Michael Jackson’s rented mansion. Soon after, and despite propofol not being a controlled substance, Dr. Murray’s ‘confession’ ignited a witch hunt with the involvement of the DEA, LAPD, LVPD & the whole justice system.


FACT: Storage/Stability: Store between 40° and 72°F (4° and 22°C). Do not freeze.
COMMENT: It wasn’t even properly stored. It should have been kept in a refrigerated storage instead of a closet.

FACT: DEA spokesman Rusty Payne confirmed Wednesday that the agency is considering adding propofol to the list of controlled substances.
COMMENT: Why was the DEA involved in an investigation of a non-controlled substance?

http://www.drugs.com/propofol.html
http://www.drugs.com/ppa/propofol.html
http://www.anesthesia-analgesia.org/cgi/reprint/105/4/1066.pdf
http://edition.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/07/02/diprivan.propofol.jackson/index.html
http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/07/did-propofol-or-diprivan-kill-michael-jackson.html
http://www.abconlinepharmacy.com/ns/customer/product2793-c-p1#diprivan_prescription
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31928660

Now we have the facts. Let’s work on some conspiracy theories. Personally, I believe propofol was “planted” or was there for other reasons and now is the scapegoat. I’m working on a couple of theories that I hope to post in a few days. Suspect
OH GOD I’M SOOOO SLACKING AT WORK!!! lol!
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:35 pm

Annie, I love you for posting this! Thanks hon


Last edited by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:40 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : the blueness)
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Post by jpresley on Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:37 pm

[quote="annieisnotokeyOH GOD I’M SOOOO SLACKING AT WORK!!! lol![/quote]

Great post and I've got stacks of paperwork on my desk that hasn't moved in two weeks! Obsession is thy name! lol!
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Post by SmoothCriminal on Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:42 pm

Great post Smile thanks for going to the troble of writing it out
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:49 pm

We do know that Janet and LaToya went into the mansion on the pretense of stealing, sorry taking the bedsheets to stop the staff (who had been fired 1/2 an hour after the announcement of the 'death') from stealing them.
The house was empty, Janet and Toya rolled up with some giant removal vans, it would have been the easiest thing in the world to plant some fake stuff like a bag of propofol in the closet - when it should have been stored properly i.e. refrigerated because propofol gets contaminated very quickly - hence the recalled bad batches.
Plant some junk around, throw some IVs and whatever and instant crime scene complete with dangerous drugs.
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Post by Guest on Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:57 pm

Those moving vans, where there WAY to fast if you ask me.
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Post by jpresley on Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:57 pm

Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:We do know that Janet and LaToya went into the mansion on the pretense of stealing, sorry taking the bedsheets to stop the staff (who had been fired 1/2 an hour after the announcement of the 'death') from stealing them.
The house was empty, Janet and Toya rolled up with some giant removal vans, it would have been the easiest thing in the world to plant some fake stuff like a bag of propofol in the closet - when it should have been stored properly i.e. refrigerated because propofol gets contaminated very quickly - hence the recalled bad batches.
Plant some junk around, throw some IVs and whatever and instant crime scene complete with dangerous drugs.

So I guess my question is then, if the propofol is part of the hoax why wouldn't it have been there to begin with? Why would Janet and LaToya need to plant anything? Surely, if this is all part of the 'plan' then those items would have already been present in the house.
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Post by annieisnotokey on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:01 pm

Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:Annie, I love you for posting this! Thanks hon

You're welcome. I love you
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:07 pm

jpresley wrote:
Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:We do know that Janet and LaToya went into the mansion on the pretense of stealing, sorry taking the bedsheets to stop the staff (who had been fired 1/2 an hour after the announcement of the 'death') from stealing them.
The house was empty, Janet and Toya rolled up with some giant removal vans, it would have been the easiest thing in the world to plant some fake stuff like a bag of propofol in the closet - when it should have been stored properly i.e. refrigerated because propofol gets contaminated very quickly - hence the recalled bad batches.
Plant some junk around, throw some IVs and whatever and instant crime scene complete with dangerous drugs.

So I guess my question is then, if the propofol is part of the hoax why wouldn't it have been there to begin with? Why would Janet and LaToya need to plant anything? Surely, if this is all part of the 'plan' then those items would have already been present in the house.
True although nobody would be able to prove it because only MJ, the kids and Dr Murray were allowed upstairs/in the bedroom.
For all we know, Dr Murray disappeared for 30-odd hours, got briefed (he would have known about the hoax already), lawyered up and then came back to talk to the police. He only revealed the location of the propofol during his second conversation (I think) with the police because they had missed it during the first search.
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Post by annieisnotokey on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:07 pm

jpresley wrote:
Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:We do know that Janet and LaToya went into the mansion on the pretense of stealing, sorry taking the bedsheets to stop the staff (who had been fired 1/2 an hour after the announcement of the 'death') from stealing them.
The house was empty, Janet and Toya rolled up with some giant removal vans, it would have been the easiest thing in the world to plant some fake stuff like a bag of propofol in the closet - when it should have been stored properly i.e. refrigerated because propofol gets contaminated very quickly - hence the recalled bad batches.
Plant some junk around, throw some IVs and whatever and instant crime scene complete with dangerous drugs.

So I guess my question is then, if the propofol is part of the hoax why wouldn't it have been there to begin with? Why would Janet and LaToya need to plant anything? Surely, if this is all part of the 'plan' then those items would have already been present in the house.

Janet & Toya could be:
* planting the propofol to help the hoax
* tampering with the scene (even without planting the propofol) to help the hoax
* just plain greedy and went in there to get whatever they could put their hands on & didn't care less about the propofol / the scene / whatever
* ...
I'm sure there are a lot more other options that I can't think of right now. Suspect
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:12 pm

I dunno, I don't think Janet would have gone in because she's independently wealthy so stealing a few bedsheets and junk doesn't make sense for her.
Now if LaToya and Joe together had gone in I would believe that lol!

Maybe it was just to make it look real, plant a few things, and whatever to stamp home the 'death'
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Post by annieisnotokey on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:16 pm

Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:Now if LaToya and Joe together had gone in I would believe that lol!


lol!
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Post by hasil on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:18 pm

GREAT POST
AND YES!! like i stated at the other forum in the start of this whole thing

anyone who has had surgery and had propofol/diprovan KNOWS how it feels when you wake up !! ""shithouse"

AND WHEN YOU GET IT THEY HAVE A LIFE SUPPORT SYSTEM RIGHT IN THE ROOM,
because many people stop breathing with this drug..so they put them on a VENTILATOR....
dr murray had a balloon in comparison with what is normally present during a
nesthesiology.
http://www.drugsearchlive.com/2009/07/video-cnns-anderson-cooper-dr-sanjay.html
watch ths video!!!

elephant


Last edited by hasil on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by annieisnotokey on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:18 pm

Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:I dunno, I don't think Janet would have gone in because she's independently wealthy so stealing a few bedsheets and junk doesn't make sense for her.
Now if LaToya and Joe together had gone in I would believe that lol!

Maybe it was just to make it look real, plant a few things, and whatever to stamp home the 'death'

Maybe Janet & Toya went to plant a few thing or to protect their brother belongings and honestly thought they needed to take everything before people break in and start stealing MJ memorabilia...

You are right, Janet being there makes me think less of greed and more of help.
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:27 pm

annieisnotokey wrote:
Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:I dunno, I don't think Janet would have gone in because she's independently wealthy so stealing a few bedsheets and junk doesn't make sense for her.
Now if LaToya and Joe together had gone in I would believe that lol!

Maybe it was just to make it look real, plant a few things, and whatever to stamp home the 'death'

Maybe Janet & Toya went to plant a few thing or to protect their brother belongings and honestly thought they needed to take everything before people break in and start stealing MJ memorabilia...

You are right, Janet being there makes me think less of greed and more of help.
I can definitely understand them taking the stuff, it's Michael's, those are his belongings. Any psycho-fan could break in or something and steal it, or the staff could go back if they had the keys and filch a few things.
Janet has always struck me as the honest one as opposed to Latoya's - well we know what she is.

Not to mention - there were hard drives with MJ songs on them which got taken away too. If that's a genuine story (John Branca could be telling porkies) then Michael may have had to leave quickly only managing to grab the cash and jewels but not the hard drives.
I'm of the mind that the Double may have died unexpectedly, or sooner than they thought he would so the plan got kickstarted which is why - although all the groundwork was in place - there are so many things which don't quite add up and everyone is telling a different story - which also helps to confuse people.
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Post by SmoothCriminal on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:28 pm

annieisnotokey wrote:
Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:Now if LaToya and Joe together had gone in I would believe that lol!


lol!

Hahahaha lmao lol!
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Post by annieisnotokey on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:28 pm

Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:
True although nobody would be able to prove it because only MJ, the kids and Dr Murray were allowed upstairs/in the bedroom.
For all we know, Dr Murray disappeared for 30-odd hours, got briefed (he would have known about the hoax already), lawyered up and then came back to talk to the police. He only revealed the location of the propofol during his second conversation (I think) with the police because they had missed it during the first search.

I did some internet research.

Apparently Murray told police about propofol in his first conversation (on Saturday, cause he was m.i.a. in the meantime), but after the police had performed the first search in MJ's rented mansion.

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/SHOWBIZ/Music/06/28/michael.jackson/index.html
http://www.tmz.com/2009/07/25/michael-jackson-dr-conrad-murray-drug-stash-lapd-propofol/

This is exciting! Suspect
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Post by annieisnotokey on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:32 pm

Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:
I'm of the mind that the Double may have died unexpectedly, or sooner than they thought he would so the plan got kickstarted which is why - although all the groundwork was in place - there are so many things which don't quite add up and everyone is telling a different story - which also helps to confuse people.

OMFG!! I'm thinking the same thing and I'm actually working on putting the pieces together with that theory in mind!! This was a hoax, but it unraveled faster than expected and that's where all the sloppiness comes from.
Too bad we don't live close to each other, we'd be invincible together... cheers
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Post by jpresley on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:35 pm

annieisnotokey wrote:
Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:I dunno, I don't think Janet would have gone in because she's independently wealthy so stealing a few bedsheets and junk doesn't make sense for her.
Now if LaToya and Joe together had gone in I would believe that lol!

Maybe it was just to make it look real, plant a few things, and whatever to stamp home the 'death'

Maybe Janet & Toya went to plant a few thing or to protect their brother belongings and honestly thought they needed to take everything before people break in and start stealing MJ memorabilia...

You are right, Janet being there makes me think less of greed and more of help.

Yes, my personal opinion of Janet is that she is beyond reproach. I don't trust Joe and LaToya as far as I can throw them, but Janet is in a whole other league. Do we have a theory going as to how many people are involved in this? I'm just wondering, could all of the slip ups be because some of the family members are truly unaware that a hoax is being played out? Or, is every single slip-up part of the plan?

BTW - I've had two surgeries. One I was out for 4 hours, the next 2 1/2. I'm not sure what anesthetic was used, but I was given one to knock me out prior to hitting surgery and then I was given another one once in the operating room. You feel like warmed up dog shit when waking up from general anesthesia. It is the worst feeling in the world. I cannot imagine Michael taking any amount of propofol at night and functioning normally the next day, much less actually perfoming on stage. Makes absolutely no sense.
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:39 pm

annieisnotokey wrote:
Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:
I'm of the mind that the Double may have died unexpectedly, or sooner than they thought he would so the plan got kickstarted which is why - although all the groundwork was in place - there are so many things which don't quite add up and everyone is telling a different story - which also helps to confuse people.

OMFG!! I'm thinking the same thing and I'm actually working on putting the pieces together with that theory in mind!! This was a hoax, but it unraveled faster than expected and that's where all the sloppiness comes from.
Too bad we don't live close to each other, we'd be invincible together... cheers
Where do you live? I'm in the UK - we can be invincible long-distance lol

I've been thinking that for a while now, the sloppiness, no two people telling the same story - I think it happened a lot sooner than anyone imagined which is why it was so unbelievably sudden. That's why it's falling apart faster as time goes by.
I'm working on trying to find something to support this theory.
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:39 pm

JP! You're back!
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Post by annieisnotokey on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:47 pm

jpresley wrote:
Yes, my personal opinion of Janet is that she is beyond reproach. I don't trust Joe and LaToya as far as I can throw them, but Janet is in a whole other league. Do we have a theory going as to how many people are involved in this? I'm just wondering, could all of the slip ups be because some of the family members are truly unaware that a hoax is being played out? Or, is every single slip-up part of the plan?

BTW - I've had two surgeries. One I was out for 4 hours, the next 2 1/2. I'm not sure what anesthetic was used, but I was given one to knock me out prior to hitting surgery and then I was given another one once in the operating room. You feel like warmed up dog shit when waking up from general anesthesia. It is the worst feeling in the world. I cannot imagine Michael taking any amount of propofol at night and functioning normally the next day, much less actually perfoming on stage. Makes absolutely no sense.

For long surgeries, propofol is used as the starting anesthetic. It looks like milk but has more consistency. Probably it is the first one they given you. And, yes, you feel like sh*t after anesthesia. Imagine going to rehearsal and dancing those complicated routines after you spent a night knocked out by propofol. IT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE.

About Janet, Toya & Family, I've come to the same conclusion. Some might know and some might not know about the hoax. That's why they can't get their stories straight and some of them are running around like headless chicken while others remain completely silent.
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:50 pm

annieisnotokey wrote:
jpresley wrote:
Yes, my personal opinion of Janet is that she is beyond reproach. I don't trust Joe and LaToya as far as I can throw them, but Janet is in a whole other league. Do we have a theory going as to how many people are involved in this? I'm just wondering, could all of the slip ups be because some of the family members are truly unaware that a hoax is being played out? Or, is every single slip-up part of the plan?

BTW - I've had two surgeries. One I was out for 4 hours, the next 2 1/2. I'm not sure what anesthetic was used, but I was given one to knock me out prior to hitting surgery and then I was given another one once in the operating room. You feel like warmed up dog shit when waking up from general anesthesia. It is the worst feeling in the world. I cannot imagine Michael taking any amount of propofol at night and functioning normally the next day, much less actually perfoming on stage. Makes absolutely no sense.

For long surgeries, propofol is used as the starting anesthetic. It looks like milk but has more consistency. Probably it is the first one they given you. And, yes, you feel like sh*t after anesthesia. Imagine going to rehearsal and dancing those complicated routines after you spent a night knocked out by propofol. IT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE.

About Janet, Toya & Family, I've come to the same conclusion. Some might know and some might not know about the hoax. That's why they can't get their stories straight and some of them are running around like headless chicken while others remain completely silent.
It does not make any sense at all, propofol, any general anesthetic leaves you feeling like sh!t run over - nobody would be able to go shopping, rehearse, sing and dance etc normally after being out for a night on that stuff.

As an aside, I'm going to be put under general anesthetic in a few months time for a small operation (about 20 mins max) but I need to be fully under - urgh, not looking forward to it.
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Post by annieisnotokey on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:51 pm

Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:
Where do you live? I'm in the UK - we can be invincible long-distance lol
I've been thinking that for a while now, the sloppiness, no two people telling the same story - I think it happened a lot sooner than anyone imagined which is why it was so unbelievably sudden. That's why it's falling apart faster as time goes by.
I'm working on trying to find something to support this theory.

I live in Argentina but, don't worry, I couldn't care less about the Falklands. LOL Wink
I dated an english man for about 4 years and I fell in love with everything british. I love you

About the hoax happening sooner than expected, I think it's totally the case. What sort of support / evidence are you trying to find? Maybe I can focus my next research on that... any suggestions??
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Post by jpresley on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:56 pm

annieisnotokey wrote:
Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:
Where do you live? I'm in the UK - we can be invincible long-distance lol
I've been thinking that for a while now, the sloppiness, no two people telling the same story - I think it happened a lot sooner than anyone imagined which is why it was so unbelievably sudden. That's why it's falling apart faster as time goes by.
I'm working on trying to find something to support this theory.

I live in Argentina but, don't worry, I couldn't care less about the Falklands. LOL Wink
I dated an english man for about 4 years and I fell in love with everything british. I love you

About the hoax happening sooner than expected, I think it's totally the case. What sort of support / evidence are you trying to find? Maybe I can focus my next research on that... any suggestions??


I'd like to volunteer as well (lord knows I'm not getting any work done at the office anyway), so let me know if you need any help researching.
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Post by jpresley on Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:58 pm

As an aside, I'm going to be put under general anesthetic in a few months time for a small operation (about 20 mins max) but I need to be fully under - urgh, not looking forward to it. [/color][/quote]

Is this your first surgery? The first time is always the scariest. They had to give me something to calm me down, my B/P shot up so freaking high.
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:00 pm

annieisnotokey wrote:
Another.Part.Of.Me wrote:
Where do you live? I'm in the UK - we can be invincible long-distance lol
I've been thinking that for a while now, the sloppiness, no two people telling the same story - I think it happened a lot sooner than anyone imagined which is why it was so unbelievably sudden. That's why it's falling apart faster as time goes by.
I'm working on trying to find something to support this theory.

I live in Argentina but, don't worry, I couldn't care less about the Falklands. LOL Wink
I dated an english man for about 4 years and I fell in love with everything british. I love you

About the hoax happening sooner than expected, I think it's totally the case. What sort of support / evidence are you trying to find? Maybe I can focus my next research on that... any suggestions??
Rofl, the Falklands was before my time, I don't care about it either lol. Argentina sounds awesome, I used to love a couple of your football players about 10/11 years ago.

I'm only in the preliminary stages of finding actual information to support the theory. I want to organise my thoughts properly because it's been on my mind for a few weeks now but I want to solidify it so I know which direction to go in and what evidence would be best to support it. It's the evidence bit which throws me a tiny bit because I'm not sure exactly what evidence would be able to support it properly.
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Propofol/Diprivan - The Media Story vs. Facts Empty Re: Propofol/Diprivan - The Media Story vs. Facts

Post by jpresley on Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:01 pm

annieisnotokey wrote:
jpresley wrote:
Yes, my personal opinion of Janet is that she is beyond reproach. I don't trust Joe and LaToya as far as I can throw them, but Janet is in a whole other league. Do we have a theory going as to how many people are involved in this? I'm just wondering, could all of the slip ups be because some of the family members are truly unaware that a hoax is being played out? Or, is every single slip-up part of the plan?

BTW - I've had two surgeries. One I was out for 4 hours, the next 2 1/2. I'm not sure what anesthetic was used, but I was given one to knock me out prior to hitting surgery and then I was given another one once in the operating room. You feel like warmed up dog shit when waking up from general anesthesia. It is the worst feeling in the world. I cannot imagine Michael taking any amount of propofol at night and functioning normally the next day, much less actually perfoming on stage. Makes absolutely no sense.

For long surgeries, propofol is used as the starting anesthetic. It looks like milk but has more consistency. Probably it is the first one they given you. And, yes, you feel like sh*t after anesthesia. Imagine going to rehearsal and dancing those complicated routines after you spent a night knocked out by propofol. IT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE.

About Janet, Toya & Family, I've come to the same conclusion. Some might know and some might not know about the hoax. That's why they can't get their stories straight and some of them are running around like headless chicken while others remain completely silent.


The only ones who have been completely silent are Janet and Rebbie. Even his mom has called into LKL once. Surely more family members know than that? Or, perhaps they didn't initially and now they do? So confusing! scratch
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Post by Another.Part.Of.Me on Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:09 pm

jpresley wrote:As an aside, I'm going to be put under general anesthetic in a few months time for a small operation (about 20 mins max) but I need to be fully under - urgh, not looking forward to it. [/color]

Is this your first surgery? The first time is always the scariest. They had to give me something to calm me down, my B/P shot up so freaking high.[/quote]

Yep first operation. I'm not scared just find it to be annoying. It's for a freakin tooth of all things. Pffttt. I hate needles though, I hope they don't use them because then I will freak out.

Oh, research, do it lol. That way you'll still be doing something productive even if it's not work. Are you sure your boss doesn't mind? Hope you don't get in any trouble!

I reckon -
- Janet and Rebbie know, well deff Janet.
- Which is the brother who hasn't done an interview? Him lol
- Harvey from TMZ which is why they got the scoop
- That Clontz website said that he was holed up in Hungary with 30 of his most trusted relatives and friends with him. I don't think it's 30 but I think there are people with him such as Mac. We haven't seen Mac in a while - the John Hughes statement was released through his spokesperson so he could easily have emailed the statement or text it to the spokesperson.
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Post by Thetruth on Tue Aug 18, 2009 5:31 am

I applade you on your work, great job! But I have to comment myself regardnig some of the facts you brought up. This is not my opinion, it is more a combination about what the media clamis.

FACT: “Propofol provides loss of awareness for short diagnostic tests and surgical procedures, sleep at the beginning of surgery,
and supplements other types of general anesthetics.”
COMMENT: Therefore, if it’s normally used for short procedures, I don’t think it would be the drug of choice to obtain 8 hour-sleep-nights.

(That is why the media is claming there were a stach of Propofol bottles because it would have been needed a lot of bottles to obtain a 8 hours sleep)

FACT: Patient Information: Advise patient that mental alertness, coordination, and physical dexterity may be impaired for some time after administration.
COMMENT: If MJ was relying on propofol to sleep at nights, he wouldn’t have been able to rehearse, dance, sing, etc. the next morning
(He did often show up late to the rehearsal and Kenny Ortega had to use imposters over 40 times)

But this other thing you found was definetly strange....
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Post by Human_nature on Tue Aug 18, 2009 7:08 am

Thetruth wrote:
COMMENT: If MJ was relying on propofol to sleep at nights, he wouldn’t have been able to rehearse, dance, sing, etc. the next morning
(He did often show up late to the rehearsal and Kenny Ortega had to use imposters over 40 times)

How do you know Kenny had to use imposters over 40 times ?? Question
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Post by mjfan on Sun Aug 23, 2009 6:53 pm

MyBelovedMJ wrote:Those moving vans, where there WAY to fast if you ask me.

Yeah they can't manage to bury MJ for two months, but they sure can RUSH right in in the middle of a time of grief to take all MJ's stuff out in vans.
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Post by annieisnotokey on Sun Aug 23, 2009 7:18 pm

Thetruth wrote:I applade you on your work, great job! But I have to comment myself regardnig some of the facts you brought up. This is not my opinion, it is more a combination about what the media clamis.

FACT: “Propofol provides loss of awareness for short diagnostic tests and surgical procedures, sleep at the beginning of surgery,
and supplements other types of general anesthetics.”
COMMENT: Therefore, if it’s normally used for short procedures, I don’t think it would be the drug of choice to obtain 8 hour-sleep-nights.

(That is why the media is claming there were a stach of Propofol bottles because it would have been needed a lot of bottles to obtain a 8 hours sleep)

FACT: Patient Information: Advise patient that mental alertness, coordination, and physical dexterity may be impaired for some time after administration.
COMMENT: If MJ was relying on propofol to sleep at nights, he wouldn’t have been able to rehearse, dance, sing, etc. the next morning
(He did often show up late to the rehearsal and Kenny Ortega had to use imposters over 40 times)

But this other thing you found was definetly strange....

Thank you for your kind words at the beginning of your post.

Regarding your comments, let me remind you that I started this thread by saying:
"Please be warned that I’m not a medical professional. What I’m posting here is the result of my best and honest effort to understand the information I researched and contrast it with the media story. Nothing more and nothing less."

I stand by everything I posted, but anybody here is entitled to interpret the same information in a different way, since we are not experts on the subject.


Last edited by annieisnotokey on Sun Aug 23, 2009 7:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by annieisnotokey on Sun Aug 23, 2009 7:20 pm

mjfan wrote:
MyBelovedMJ wrote:Those moving vans, where there WAY to fast if you ask me.

Yeah they can't manage to bury MJ for two months, but they sure can RUSH right in in the middle of a time of grief to take all MJ's stuff out in vans.

Agreed!!! lol!
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